3 May


Stop this disgraceful abuse or I will implement PUNISHMENTS and they won’t be pretty.




  1. samjandwich May 3, 2013 at 1:51 pm #

    Forrest Gumpp, yes I agree this does seem to be about self-awareness.

    Something I take an interest in is the subject of domestic violence, why it happens, and why despite our best efforts we appear to be powerless to stop it.

    I was reading this report the other day, , which shows that people under certain types of personal stress are more likely to experience physical violence.

    A cynical person, or someone who likes to appeal to the concept of class like Jeremy Sammut from the CIS for example, might see this study as a politically correct attempt to show that there is an underclass of people who lead endemically chaotic, dysfunctional lives and who bring misfortune upon themselves.

    I would say however, that to attempt to show relationships between indicators of disadvantage is to entirely miss the substance of what is actually going on, and attempting to address violence by ameliorating people’s personal circumstances is a blind alley.

    Bear with me for a minute, because at this point I’m just idly hypothesising during my lunch hour and don’t have time to expand on it properly – but it seems to me that the only element of this that’s really endemic and meaningful is that some people have an inherent tendency towards being abusive towards others, and that this abusiveness is associated with a lack of self-awareness, and a belief in objective absolutes.

    Viz, something atomou said to Helvi the other day: ‘“Are you going to be happy only when you have driven everyone else away from here with your persistent rudeness….?”

    Shit that made me laugh H! You’re certainly consistent. You and your tag team partner accused me of doing that on another blog, when they were emailing me and telling me they couldn’t stand your and your tag team partner’s constant wallowing in these two phrases: “Why is Australia such a shit country?” And, “you’re bullying everybody!”

    You’re certainly consistent, H. Myopic but consistent!”

    I won’t deny that there might be an opportunity for constructive criticism here, but what Atomou is actually doing is casting his own viewpoint as the valid and predominant one, and attempting to use it to mock and belittle Helvi by denigrating other things she has said, rather than to answer the current issue in a sensible way. For those of us beholden to Politics, that is what John Howard used to do… but as someone who had no scruples about sinking to the deepest depths of depravity in order to get his own way, he acquiesced to do it as a deliberate strategy. Atomou on the other hand, as is clear to those who think about such things, clearly has some significant difficulty in imagining his behaviour as being reprehensible, and so instead of subsuming Helvi’s criticism, as someone more mature and in touch with themselves would do, he descends into vitriolic personal attacks. Or to put it another way, abusiveness. The fact that he’s incapable of, or refusing to acknowledge it as such, is just a further demonstration that he imagines himself to have gotten away with it, when in fact it’s quite transparent that the opposite is true.

    I don’t think that abusiveness and its effects can ever be meaningfully quantifiable in indicators of things like the extent of domestic violence, partly due to the uncertainty about the extent to which it occurs versus the extent to which it is reported, but also because abusive behaviour exists on a continuum, from serious violence to spiteful neglect – but it’s still abuse in essence. Abuse is abuse is abuse if you like. It has nothing to do with social or financial status, gender, power or lack thereof, age, intelligence, spiritual disposition etc… or even the “type’ and severity of it. It’s a behaviour, emanating from a particular personal disposition, which sits in isolation. And I would like to believe that people (or at least, those who are not sociopathic or disordered in some way) can learn, or be taught how and why not to engage in it, by being encouraged to get in closer touch with their feelings, and by having the consequences of their actions brought home to them by people who they are willing to listen to… but it takes courage to admit to being in the wrong.

    The fact is though, that anyone who claims to be unequivocally right, especially when someone else insists otherwise, is actually constitutively in the wrong, and shows a lack of self-and-other awareness, because nobody can know everything.

    If we want to stop things like domestic violence then as a society we will need to improve our ability to recognise abuse wherever it occurs, in ourselves and in each other, to emphasise that it’s unacceptable and counter-productive, and to bring instances of it to an abrupt end whenever we see it happening. Otherwise, we create an environment that allows it to thrive.


    • Forrest Gumpp (@ForrestGumpp) May 4, 2013 at 9:56 am #

      Thank you, samjandwich, for a literary witness to the earlier brief existence of my first comment to this blog post of Jennifer’s. Sadly, it has disappeared as part of the inevitable collateral damage accompanying the wielding of such broad brush strokes as now appear to have been necessary in cleaning up the comments threads on ‘Sheep’. Normally I would have had a copy of it as compiled in my text editor, but it was so brief that I simply typed it into the ‘Sheep’ posting pane, and now it is gone for me, too. Baaaa!

      One of the things I had in mind in attributing an encouragement of commenters to self-awareness to Jennifer’s ‘Effing Housekeeping’ post was that of consideration of the effect upon the blog in general of drawn out contentions that tend to become abusive. I can only think it operates to turn as yet non-posting viewers off, as well as deter potentially interesting but erstwhile only occasional posters from developing interesting perspectives on matters under discussion.

      Dilutes the impact of the blog.

      This brings us to the vexed question of posting ON TOPIC. One of the most basic ways of disrespecting Jennifer’s blog, and the time and experience that lies behind the bulk of her posts, is to post off-topic, let alone attempt to hijack discussions. Prone as I am to tangentiality in my posting, I find it a useful discipline to try to tie any perspective I am trying to develop in my comment to at least something in Jennifer’s blog post.

      Interesting the parallel you draw between online abusiveness and domestic violence. Is it that some persons feel that they can only make themselves look good in their own eyes by making others look bad, with the ‘making of them look bad’ achieved by subjecting them to abuse? Is the commonality between domestic abuse and online abuse that of having an essentially captive audience in the abuser’s perception in each case?

      Now, before I forget, I will rescue the napalm-charred remnant of the collateral damage constituted by my answer to Jennifer’s question “I GAVE YOU A HAPPY PLACE WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT???????”, and ask again can the ‘Recent Comments’ panel be repositioned where it formerly used to be beneath the ‘Latest Tweets’ panel? That is something more I want.

      Of course, all of the foregoing (napalm strike included) presumes that the coming to be of abusiveness and off-topicality on any given blog is spontaneous and without any ulterior purpose, a presumption that does not sit entirely well with me. Abusiveness and contention could be a substitute for blog censorship, in cases where The Bloggess both proves unmoved by threats and is seen as saying important/annoying things.


    • helvityni May 4, 2013 at 3:40 pm #

      Sam, it’s always good to be understood, even it might be just by one in ten or in a hundred, thank you.
      For so many on these blogs it’s all about ME, the terribly clever author of the posts, the others are just an admiring audience, and if they are not in that category, then they are enemies to be abused .Even their musical tastes are to be ridiculed; Sibelius is TOO dark, since when is it a sin to like serious music, or to appreciate excellent writers like Patrick White, or to value Henson’s beautiful photography…

      How often do I have to repeat that I’m no Rudd or Gillard lover, but a Labor voter who prefers Labor in power. Also , do I have to share my place with ten asylum seekers to get Marilyn off my back…I’m happy to take them all in…


      • helvityni May 4, 2013 at 3:43 pm #

        This is a reply to Sam’s post above.


        • paul walter May 4, 2013 at 4:55 pm #

          Well spoken Helvi, second it unconditionally.


          • helvityni May 4, 2013 at 7:34 pm #

            Muchas Gracias, Paul. Personal attacks are not welcomed by anyone, but we can always leave the abusive sites .Why would anyone want to spoil someone else’s blog….?
            If only the poster’s own opinions matter , then it’s best to open up one’s own blog where you are the ‘boss’, where you set the rules.


    • doug quixote May 4, 2013 at 7:30 pm #

      A fine summary, Sam. Atomou is clearly intelligent and has some specialised learning regarding Greek culture, but his defect as you have identified is that he is certain that he is always in the right; contradiction invites abuse and collateral attack, in an immature fashion.


  2. Toni Blackmore May 3, 2013 at 3:10 pm #

    Huh? This can’t have attracted abuse, surely!


    • Forrest Gumpp (@ForrestGumpp) May 3, 2013 at 3:32 pm #

      There has had to be a Great Deletion. Inevitably such involves some collateral damage. Think of it as being like a napalm strike. Why, only this morning ….

      There were warning signs, for those who had ears to see.


    • Forrest Gumpp (@ForrestGumpp) May 5, 2013 at 11:11 am #

      There had to be a Great Deletion because:


  3. paul walter May 3, 2013 at 3:51 pm #

    I think the creative side of Mrs Perfect represented, in determining that the new “Delectrolux” vacuum-cleaner can suck up the reek of nappified baby shit, at arms length, is most uplifting.


  4. paul walter May 3, 2013 at 3:57 pm #

    You know, its really a case of the Giant Hoo-Poo bird caught red-handed this time, before it can spread its doom and gloom all over the shop.


  5. atomou May 4, 2013 at 7:21 pm #

    Someone please hand H a medal. She disagrees with me on my musical tastes, she disagrees with me on my literary tastes and she disagrees with me on Henson’s photography.
    Actually, no. She just disagrees with me full stop. She has chosen to misread all of my comments on these three issues, as she has chosen to misread and then misrepresent everything I said about these three issues.
    Someone please give her a medal!
    It’s OK, H. I’m out of here for good straight after this; that is to say, if Jennifer even decides to allow my right of reply to your relentless attacks.
    I’m out of here because there seems to be a preference for your type of coy vulgarity than for a forthright response to criticism.
    I’m out of here because I cannot cope with insipid language and sheep-like jaw movements that make monosyllabic utterances.
    I’m out of here because honesty has been shackled by PC and “be nice to one another” sunday school orders.
    I’m out of here because your type of waiting till the person is away before you splurge on the bile – and THAT behaviour is accepted because… well, sycophants and poo-stacked puppets are often mistaken for someone nice. But you and your little (minded) tag team partner are not nice. Not in the slightest!

    And, Jennifer, what I say here I am always prepared to say to anyone’s face and expect that person to say whatever s/he’s thinking back to my face, not behind my back. THAT is cowardly. THAT is not nice!

    Enjoy the sheep paddock folks.

    Marilyn and Hypo, I’m gonna miss you but, shit, ey? Them’s the breaks!

    Over and out!

    Give it your best shot, posters!


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